@masterofthetiger If you're curious, I - and a bunch of other folk - have that instance blocked, as it is a hotbed of white supremacy. I like our talks and am concerned that if you further surround yourself with folk like that, you'll lose access to diverse voices without maybe realizing it.
(Why do I block hotbeds of supremacy, if I think some folk there should hear what I have to say? Because those hotbeds harass and threaten me and my friends, despite having some members who aren't bad.)
@emsenn I have always been confused at the accusations of white supremacy, racism, transphobia, etc on QOTO.org. Could you give me some examples of these which were not adequately handled by the moderators?
@masterofthetiger Believe it or not, but between earning an income, maintaining my household, and fulfilling volunteer obligations, I don't actually find the time to keep track of random meanies on the Internet.
Additionally, their policy of federating with everyone means that even if their users are respectful, it carries my posts to servers like gab and kiwifarm, providing an ingress for those bigots.
Okay, that's fair. But could you tell me why you see them as a "hotbed" for those groups?
theres.life does not block those servers, but has a strict moderation policy. My policy is to see if there is a problem with an instance, and deal with it accordingly. I guess I am fortunate for this to be a small instance and I don't have to deal with the haters as much.
@masterofthetiger Because I notice when people I haven't talked to before reply to me, and I notice that they're on that server, and they're replying with some nonsense like "but are native folk REALLY being genocided?" ;)
Basically, people from that instance chime up just to argue against equality or in favor of supremacy, in my experience, and if that isn't a "hotbed of supremacy" I don't know what is.
@masterofthetiger Regarding the second point, yes it's just that you're a smaller instance; the second I were to notice that people from other instances were @'ing me because they saw my posts because they follow you, I'd probably block you.
(I'm sure this all sounds extreme, but like, the sort of harassment I'm talking about segues so quickly and effortlessly into doxxing and SWATting, so I find it very important to nip it in the bud.)
@masterofthetiger Like you wouldn't go back to a pub if walking in the door risked you getting an egg chucked at your head, right? You'd just... go to a different pub.
That's how I treat the Internet: I can block folk all day and all that ever happens is that there's more people to talk to and they're ever-so-slightly-less-likely to expose me to bigotry and harassment.
@emsenn I am followed by people on Gab, but no racists as far as I have seen. I also follow some Christians on Gab (and I try to encourage them to move elsewhere in the Fediverse). All in all, the interaction which theres.life has had with Gab has been positive.
I even boost Christian posts on occasion from that instance.
I have one or two extreme conservative people I am following (and although you may be appalled by them, they are not racist as far as I have interacted with them), but that does not mean I agree with them. I also follow people from the other side of the spectrum. There are a few extreme liberals who I am following as well.
Haha. Once I recently noticed that one of the people I am following had said that climate change was a hoax, then another guy I am following said he wished all climate change deniers should be killed (more or less).
@masterofthetiger I know that probably sounds like you're saying "I am so accepting of diverse positions and viewpoints!" but honestly what I hear is "I am so disconnected from the reality of these things being discussed, I can treat it all just as discussion and opinions."
@masterofthetiger That is, you sound like you're using this platform to "tour" different opinions and belief structures, and that gives a lot of legitimacy to the "I wanna genocide folk" side, with comments like "extremely conservative but not racist" like extremely conservative policies aren't actively killing the global south.
You don't sound open-minded, just privileged enough that none of these issues are more than online conversations.
@masterofthetiger Tangent but gosh I do appreciate that we've had enough conversations I can just say this stuff witohut worrying too much about if I'm saying it nicely.
@emsenn Yeah. I understand. I'll admit that I am a bit focused on discussion and opinions. I am obsessed with those, sometimes to the point where I neglect some compassion and reality.
Belief structures are important though. Why do the haters hate? Why are people evil? Etc. But I do agree that those people are wrong and what they do (or at least want to do) is inexcusable.
However, we all are evil. There is no one who can say truthfully that they are not. If someone clearly wants to repent and actually change, they may still have the consequences for what they have done, but they can and should be forgiven. Sadly not too many of those people are repentant. But something someone said 10 years ago may not be the same person as they are now. Note: this paragraph is a bad rabbit trail and you may ignore it.
The extremely conservative guy I was thinking about is a anarcho-capitalist. Most of his ideas just go insane often (if you are reading this, don't reply).
@masterofthetiger Yea I'm definitely not trying to discourage learning this information - just expressing how it looks from here.
And like, obviously you'll lose perspective sometimes - you're learning about things outside your lived experience, so any moment you relax, you're gonna lose perspective a bit.
I'm not too critical for people having done bad - it's people that are doing bad, and well, ignorance is no excuse, because /I/ can see the bad 1/n
@masterofthetiger and so like, eh. I don't have to turn a blind eye to learn more about their perspective. I don't even think it's particularly my job to teach them about the evils I see. I do have an obligation to resist it - and that often means just ostracizing the person saying some bullshit.
(This was also a ramble.)
I guess I just don't see much use in hearing those sorts of perspectives from people living them. They're exploitative and bad, I can learn them from a book, lol.
@masterofthetiger And, if you're curious, I actually used to identify as anarcho-capitalist myself, because I very much appreciated that philosophy's emphasis on consent and voluntarism. However, I've come to think that the holding of capital cannot lead to anything but inequity, and that removes any possibility of real consent.
Oh - I thought of another thing I think I wanna add, another tangent tho
@masterofthetiger Keep in mind that while "lynch the blacks" and "lynch the capitalists" might seem "equally" radical, it's important to recognize that the systemic powers in our society right now support the former, but not the latter, and so a lot of our society - and thus how we talk about this stuff - is biased toward that sort of perspective. I mean hell, you're presenting "kill people for profit" and "emancipate humanity" as similarly radical views, y'know?
@masterofthetiger I think listening to all these opinions as though it's just discussion helps keep that sort of thinking feeling valid, because in order to understand what the far right are saying, you have to know their lingo, and their lingo is very heavily skewed toward erasing exploitation and prioritizing growth and gain.
So you've got them using that language, and the mainstream using that language... can you really learn what the left is saying, with such "loud" other language?
@masterofthetiger Sorry I feel like I'm explaining this badly and my cat is being really obnoxious and climbing over me so it's hard to phrase it better.
@masterofthetiger THere's this comic I can't find that's:
Lady: I think there's truth in both sides, so the real truth is somewhere in the middle
Friend: But if that's the case, people can make you believe whatever they want by just moving the far side, so the middle moves closer to them.
Lady: They can make me believe /some/ of what they want.
I think that's the risk of treating these issues like intellectual discussions, not recognizing them as how our world works.
@emsenn Honestly, I think this is a big matter of prospective. The left's voice is pretty loud as well. You can also see the the country is pretty well divided, which means no political system seems to be reigning supreme at the moment. One show of that is the election of Donald Trump. It was extremely close, to the point that the popular vote favored Clinton.
@masterofthetiger Yea see no this just proves my point - Clinton is like, on the right, in any sort of honest political spectrum. You don't even have a conception of what "the left" actually is, because our society is sunk so far into conservativism.
The left - the real notions of communism, socialism, unionism - are not at all prevalent in our society, at all. At best they're conversations being had in closed circles, unlike conservative things which are our /government institutions/
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